Fedelar Erection

[Porky]

I hope weed is never legalised!!
What I'm more concerned about is the rampant destruction of the environment and multinational companies paying more tax than 1 to 2 cents on every dollar they make. Fix those 2 and we have a decent environment to live in and billions more to go round for everyone!!
2 things far more important than weather fucking weed is legalised or not.

 

[freddie]

@ seeded. We're never going to agree on Clive Palmer. I think he is absolute scum. A lying grifter if ever I've seen one. Should be selling used cars somewhere, or maybe jailed for failing to pay his workers.

As for parties and legislation. We actually have laws in Canberra allowing a couple of plants (shitty legislation but a start). Similar legislation in SA in the past.
Personally, I don't want decriminalisation; I want legalisation. Legalise Australia seem to want that.

Party Policy - Legalise Cannabis Australia

Legalisation will enable access to cannabis therapeutics via home-grow and licensed dispensaries supplied by licensed growers.

legalise.org.au

If I vote Greens, I certainly won't ignore their other policies, but again, from what you post I completely disagree. I think climate change will put other matters into insignificance. You won't have an economy if there are climatic changes that effect our food production for starters.
The Greens also state that the war on drugs has been a failure and want to legalise sale of cannabis and MDMA, however there would be licences needed to sell, but no licence to grow your own. Their proposal allows home grows of up to 6 plants. Fine by me. As far as selling it goes, I would actually like growers to be licensed to sell, as it would force them to put out a reasonable safe product (no sprays or PGRs etc.)

Legalise It | Australian Greens

greens.org.au

The drug war has failed - Greens announce plan to legalise MDMA | Australian Greens

Today the Greens NSW have announced that they will move to legalise and regulate the sale of MDMA in NSW. After the election the Greens will introduce a private members bill to legalise and regulate the sale of MDMA as well as move for a parliamentary inquiry.

greens.org.au

 

[Billygoat]

We're never going to agree on Clive Palmer. I think he is absolute scum. A lying grifter if ever I've seen one. Should be selling used cars somewhere, or maybe jailed for failing to pay his workers.

As for parties and legislation. We actually have laws in Canberra allowing a couple of plants (shitty legislation but a start). Similar legislation in SA in the past.
Personally, I don't want decriminalisation; I want legalisation. Legalise Australia seem to want that.

Party Policy - Legalise Cannabis Australia

Legalisation will enable access to cannabis therapeutics via home-grow and licensed dispensaries supplied by licensed growers.

legalise.org.au

If I vote Greens, I certainly won't ignore their other policies, but again, from what you post I completely disagree. I think climate change will put other matters into insignificance. You won't have an economy if there are climatic changes that effect our food production for starters.
The Greens also state that the war on drugs has been a failure and want to legalise sale of cannabis and MDMA, however there would be licences needed to sell, but no licence to grow your own. Their proposal allows home grows of up to 6 plants. Fine by me. As far as selling it goes, I would actually like growers to be licensed to sell, as it would force them to put out a reasonable safe product (no sprays or PGRs etc.)

Legalise It | Australian Greens

greens.org.au

The drug war has failed - Greens announce plan to legalise MDMA | Australian Greens

Today the Greens NSW have announced that they will move to legalise and regulate the sale of MDMA in NSW. After the election the Greens will introduce a private members bill to legalise and regulate the sale of MDMA as well as move for a parliamentary inquiry.

greens.org.au

Just remember where a vote for the Greens will end up

 

[Jaz]

Just remember where a vote for the Greens will end up

Put them at the bottom in your preferences but above the major two.

j

 

[Unknown User]

I have watched the interviews with Palmer, hanson, and the other right wing nutter. All I can say, is if aust were to go with any of them. We would be well and truly fucked. They have no clue about how to run a country, let alone an economy, other than to line their own pockets. We just saw the farce that occurred in the USA with trump. No thanks. I would rather vote for a fuckin brick.

 

[Unknown User]

and no offense guys. Love you all. But my opinion on politics is created by what I see and experience. It is unlikely to be swayed by anyone else’s opinions. And to that I extend you the same. I won’t try and sway you. Take my opinion with a grain of salt.

 

[Jaz]

my opinion on politics is created by what I see and experience. It is unlikely to be swayed by anyone else’s opinions.

Gotta be real careful with propaganda though, it has a way of taking what you see and spinning it out of control. Remember all those black gangs taking control of Melbourne.... you saw it with your own eyes on the TV's... or so they'd have you believe. The police commissioner then gets up and says the crime stats show crime is going down and it's quite safe on the streets of Melb.
A few weeks later no more articles on black gangs and we've all forgotten they were even a thing.

The media's job is to push the articles that scare your mum and make your dad angry. They're the articles that sell the most papers.

j

 

[freddie]

There's also the Reason Party who have some ok policies on Drug Law Reform, among other things. Decriminalisation of all drugs.

Drug Law Reform

www.reason.org.au

Decriminalise illicit drugs and legalise and regulate cannabis

Parliamentary Budget Office logo

sway.office.com

 

[freddie]

Just remember where a vote for the Greens will end up

Also remember you don't have to follow your parties voting card preferences. But yeah, Greens will generally go to Labor in the lower house, unless you number the ballot paper differently to their voting card.

 

[seeded]

@ seeded. We're never going to agree on Clive Palmer. I think he is absolute scum. A lying grifter if ever I've seen one. Should be selling used cars somewhere, or maybe jailed for failing to pay his workers.

As for parties and legislation. We actually have laws in Canberra allowing a couple of plants (shitty legislation but a start). Similar legislation in SA in the past.
Personally, I don't want decriminalisation; I want legalisation. Legalise Australia seem to want that.

Party Policy - Legalise Cannabis Australia

Legalisation will enable access to cannabis therapeutics via home-grow and licensed dispensaries supplied by licensed growers.

legalise.org.au

If I vote Greens, I certainly won't ignore their other policies, but again, from what you post I completely disagree. I think climate change will put other matters into insignificance. You won't have an economy if there are climatic changes that effect our food production for starters.
The Greens also state that the war on drugs has been a failure and want to legalise sale of cannabis and MDMA, however there would be licences needed to sell, but no licence to grow your own. Their proposal allows home grows of up to 6 plants. Fine by me. As far as selling it goes, I would actually like growers to be licensed to sell, as it would force them to put out a reasonable safe product (no sprays or PGRs etc.)

Legalise It | Australian Greens

greens.org.au

The drug war has failed - Greens announce plan to legalise MDMA | Australian Greens

Today the Greens NSW have announced that they will move to legalise and regulate the sale of MDMA in NSW. After the election the Greens will introduce a private members bill to legalise and regulate the sale of MDMA as well as move for a parliamentary inquiry.

greens.org.au

I agree with you on Clive, he is absolute scum, it's just that I believe the UAP to be the best option for the nation this election. In any other election cycle I'd almost be just as against him as you are.

As for the links you posted they're all about regulation and taxation of the industry which I'm in agreement with but there's nothing about home growing except from the folks over at Nimbin who've got the exact right stance about what legalisation should be but don't care for the realities of working within the political system which will never allow such policies to exist. They're ignorant of reality and therefor their entire party, if you can even call it one, is to be totally disregarded.

I don't think people like yourself actually believe that home growing won't be possible under legalisation. It's impossible. It'll never happen in a million years unless you kill all our politicians off, remove us from the united nations, declare yourself king of Australia and then have the military might to force everyone in line including external threats like the USA who will take a dim view of our loss of democracy and stance towards narcotics. That's literally what it will take for it to be grown like grapes as the Nimbin people want. The only option that ends the war on drugs in a sane way is total decriminalisation where there are no laws on the books because if there are no laws there's no legal or illegal markets and the UN and it's convention on narcotics can go fuck itself. Obviously this has issues like commercial growers not being forced to lab test their gear, the government being unable to sin tax the plant, minors will have access to it, etc. but that is no different to how things are now which is why I don't really care about legalisation. All we need are the laws stripped from the books and we're golden and until there's a party that advocates for just that all I'm seeing is them calling for a continued war on us which I will not vote for.

 

[freddie]

I agree with you on Clive, he is absolute scum, it's just that I believe the UAP to be the best option for the nation this election. In any other election cycle I'd almost be just as against him as you are.

As for the links you posted they're all about regulation and taxation of the industry which I'm in agreement with but there's nothing about home growing except from the folks over at Nimbin who've got the exact right stance about what legalisation should be but don't care for the realities of working within the political system which will never allow such policies to exist. They're ignorant of reality and therefor their entire party, if you can even call it one, is to be totally disregarded.

I don't think people like yourself actually believe that home growing won't be possible under legalisation. It's impossible. It'll never happen in a million years unless you kill all our politicians off, remove us from the united nations, declare yourself king of Australia and then have the military might to force everyone in line including external threats like the USA who will take a dim view of our loss of democracy and stance towards narcotics. That's literally what it will take for it to be grown like grapes as the Nimbin people want. The only option that ends the war on drugs in a sane way is total decriminalisation where there are no laws on the books because if there are no laws there's no legal or illegal markets and the UN and it's convention on narcotics can go fuck itself. Obviously this has issues like commercial growers not being forced to lab test their gear, the government being unable to sin tax the plant, minors will have access to it, etc. but that is no different to how things are now which is why I don't really care about legalisation. All we need are the laws stripped from the books and we're golden and until there's a party that advocates for just that all I'm seeing is them calling for a continued war on us which I will not vote for.

Jeez, you didn't read the links, but happy to comment anyway?
From the Greens site:
"Establishing cannabis retail shops, allowing the growth of up to six plants at home for personal use ".

From Legalise Australia:
"Reforms allowing consumers and/or carers to grow cannabis in their gardens or indoors".

It's happening in other parts of the world, and even Canberra which allows 2 plants (which is also another part of the world). No reason it can't happen here.
Btw, here are the current laws in Canberra;
If you’re aged 18 and over in the ACT, you can now:

• possess up to 50 grams of dried cannabis or up to 150 grams of fresh cannabis
• grow up to two cannabis plants per person, with a maximum of four plants per household
• use cannabis in your home (personal use).

Home - Cannabis

www.act.gov.au

 

[Sedge]

Coppers see a plant in Canberra and will take it if they think it will weigh more than the 150 grams ,,

So don’t get carried away thinking the law there is so great.

 

[freddie]

No, I agree it's a shit law, but a start. I only posted because seeded said Australia would never allow homegrown. It would be hard to grow a plant that only yielded 25 grams dry.

 

[seeded]

Jeez, you didn't read the links, but happy to comment anyway?
From the Greens site:
"Establishing cannabis retail shops, allowing the growth of up to six plants at home for personal use ".

From Legalise Australia:
"Reforms allowing consumers and/or carers to grow cannabis in their gardens or indoors".

It's happening in other parts of the world, and even Canberra which allows 2 plants (which is also another part of the world). No reason it can't happen here.
Btw, here are the current laws in Canberra;
If you’re aged 18 and over in the ACT, you can now:

• possess up to 50 grams of dried cannabis or up to 150 grams of fresh cannabis
• grow up to two cannabis plants per person, with a maximum of four plants per household
• use cannabis in your home (personal use).

Home - Cannabis

www.act.gov.au

I actually did read the links and mentioned regulated to cover the bullshit limits imposed on home growers. Greens with their 6 plants might make you happy for example but for me that's absolutely nothing and I would remain a criminal. So much for fuckin legal. The ACT is a fucking joke too, two plants with such low limits that it's impossible to be in compliance with them isn't legalisation. The legalise australia mob have legit smoked themselves retarded because the laws they're advocating for are impossible to get into place which means they're not even worth considering voting for even if they are the only ones with what amounts to actual legalisation in the best way for everyone.

The only way we get to treat cannabis like grapes is if we get outright decriminalisation. There is no possible way that we can have legalisation without restrictions, licensing, invasions of privacy to ensure compliance, etc. and I wholly reject that as a condition of winning the war on drugs. We should fight until we win actual freedom and never compromise with the enemy considering it's the goddamn government that's meant to represent the people. As I said earlier legalisation is just the government going ok we lose and now we get everything while we get to continue to wage the war against you. We need decriminalisation or we might as well keep the status quo because at least everything remains in our hands instead of theirs and since no one, not even the hippy party in nimbin, advocates for decriminalisation they can all get fucked and we should concentrate our votes based on other issues since nothing is going to change for us anyway.

 

[Jaz]

The ACT is a fucking joke too, two plants with such low limits that it's impossible to be in compliance with them isn't legalisation.

I recall back in the 90's (I think) in the ACT you could smoke, carry up to a certain amount and grow 1 plant and for some reason they stopped that a decade or so later?
Does anyone recall why? Was it a trial or did some old-fogey politician decide to reverse criminalise it again?

j

 

[durban kid]

I actually did read the links and mentioned regulated to cover the bullshit limits imposed on home growers. Greens with their 6 plants might make you happy for example but for me that's absolutely nothing and I would remain a criminal. So much for fuckin legal. The ACT is a fucking joke too, two plants with such low limits that it's impossible to be in compliance with them isn't legalisation. The legalise australia mob have legit smoked themselves retarded because the laws they're advocating for are impossible to get into place which means they're not even worth considering voting for even if they are the only ones with what amounts to actual legalisation in the best way for everyone.

The only way we get to treat cannabis like grapes is if we get outright decriminalisation. There is no possible way that we can have legalisation without restrictions, licensing, invasions of privacy to ensure compliance, etc. and I wholly reject that as a condition of winning the war on drugs. We should fight until we win actual freedom and never compromise with the enemy considering it's the goddamn government that's meant to represent the people. As I said earlier legalisation is just the government going ok we lose and now we get everything while we get to continue to wage the war against you. We need decriminalisation or we might as well keep the status quo because at least everything remains in our hands instead of theirs and since no one, not even the hippy party in nimbin, advocates for decriminalisation they can all get fucked and we should concentrate our votes based on other issues since nothing is going to change for us anyway.

wow if six plants isint enough for you your not growing them right or have a way to crazy habit

 

[freddie]

I actually did read the links and mentioned regulated to cover the bullshit limits imposed on home growers. Greens with their 6 plants might make you happy for example but for me that's absolutely nothing and I would remain a criminal. So much for fuckin legal. The ACT is a fucking joke too, two plants with such low limits that it's impossible to be in compliance with them isn't legalisation. The legalise australia mob have legit smoked themselves retarded because the laws they're advocating for are impossible to get into place which means they're not even worth considering voting for even if they are the only ones with what amounts to actual legalisation in the best way for everyone.

The only way we get to treat cannabis like grapes is if we get outright decriminalisation. There is no possible way that we can have legalisation without restrictions, licensing, invasions of privacy to ensure compliance, etc. and I wholly reject that as a condition of winning the war on drugs. We should fight until we win actual freedom and never compromise with the enemy considering it's the goddamn government that's meant to represent the people. As I said earlier legalisation is just the government going ok we lose and now we get everything while we get to continue to wage the war against you. We need decriminalisation or we might as well keep the status quo because at least everything remains in our hands instead of theirs and since no one, not even the hippy party in nimbin, advocates for decriminalisation they can all get fucked and we should concentrate our votes based on other issues since nothing is going to change for us anyway.

For starters you said govt would not allow homegrown in "a million years" a few posts back, yet in Canberra they do. Yes it isn't ideal, but it is a start.

The 6 plants is for homegrowers to supply themselves. If you can't make do with 6 plants you are doing something wrong. If you are a commercial grower you'd have the option of becoming licensed.

As for decriminalisation, I linked a party that exactly wants that; the Reason party. I even linked their blurb about the Portugal model.

You seem to have set ideas that are unlikely to change, even with evidence. The war on drugs stems back to Nixon's days. I think the world has moved on from that thinking, albeit slowly. Where it started, the US, now has many States which have basically legalised, Federal is slow. In Oregon you can even get psilocybin legally. The bastion of War on Drugs has fallen, yet you are still acting like it hasn't. Even Thailand is going legal. Anyway, no offence but I think I'll stop replying to this as it is going nowhere. Read the links and let it sink in, or don't.
Cheers.

 

[Jaz]

As for decriminalisation, I linked a party that exactly wants that; the Reason party. I even linked their blurb about the Portugal model.

The authority would have powers comparable to an arbitration committee and would have a broad range of sanctions available to it when ruling on the drug possession offence. Similar to Portuguese model, the authority would have the following powers:

• fines, ranging from $40 to $240
• suspension of the right to practice if the user has a licensed profession (e.g. medical doctor, taxi driver) and may endanger another person or someone's possessions
• ban on visiting certain places (e.g. specific clubbing venues)
• ban on associating with specific other persons
• foreign travel ban
• requirement to report periodically to the committee
• withdrawal of the right to carry a gun
• confiscation of personal possessions
• cessation of subsidies or allowances that a person receives from a public agency.

^ What's with all this shit?
That's basically 'criminalisation-lite'.

The reason the Portuguese model was so successful was the way they integrated addicts back into society once caught.

When caught, they were offered the choice to pay a fine or go to rehab, hence the users without jobs ended up in rehab. The govt. offered incentives to employers to take on those that had done the rehab, etc. so the addicts weren't thrown back onto the streets where boredom would lead them to use again. Once they started work, most stopped using and started leading productive lives.

There was also an increase of drug education in schools, increase in treatment centres, mental health services, etc. it was a many pronged approach and looked a damn sight better than that 'penalty-based system' listed above.

For those that don't know, addiction comes with boredom, lack of community and lack of prospects. The best example of this we saw this in Vietnam where many soldiers frustrated at the war, with no hope, started using heroin, there was a staggering number of addicts but when they returned, many went back to their families and jobs and didn't go back to using. Those that went back to unemployment, ended up living on the streets, etc. kept using.

See - Rat Park experiment below, to curb your addiction, you need your version of 'rat park' and this is what the govt. need to understand, a simple decriminalisation without appropriate support will not work at reducing addiction... and then they'll blame drugs, restrict them again and we'll go back to square one.

j

 

[Pikey]

so the addicts weren't thrown back onto the streets where boredom would lead them to use again.

Way to trivialise addiction

 

[HGO]

For starters you said govt would not allow homegrown in "a million years" a few posts back, yet in Canberra they do. Yes it isn't ideal, but it is a start.

The 6 plants is for homegrowers to supply themselves. If you can't make do with 6 plants you are doing something wrong. If you are a commercial grower you'd have the option of becoming licensed.

As for decriminalisation, I linked a party that exactly wants that; the Reason party. I even linked their blurb about the Portugal model.

You seem to have set ideas that are unlikely to change, even with evidence. The war on drugs stems back to Nixon's days. I think the world has moved on from that thinking, albeit slowly. Where it started, the US, now has many States which have basically legalised, Federal is slow. In Oregon you can even get psilocybin legally. The bastion of War on Drugs has fallen, yet you are still acting like it hasn't. Even Thailand is going legal. Anyway, no offence but I think I'll stop replying to this as it is going nowhere. Read the links and let it sink in, or don't.
Cheers.

I want to be able to legally grow as many as I want to not for profit but to conduct real pheno hunts
with dozens and dozens of plants
Fuck having to get a license and paying exorbitant fees etc
It needs to be FULLY Legalised Federally